Epocdigest V1 # 325

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Epoc Digest Sun, 24 Aug 2003 Volume 01 : Number 325

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Sent to: 803 subscribers

In today's Epoc Digest 16 messages:

==============================

- Digest business

- 9210 printing

- CF update

- RTF files...

- Subject: Symbian Word format and RTF conversion macro

- Subject: netBook pro

- Re: Psion Replacement

- Re: opera save pdf problem

- Long lasting S7/netBook

- Re: Can't Resist An OT

- Re: EPOC DIGEST V1 # 323 (3)

- Re: Word

- Re: Netbook Pro, Revo Battery Solution,

- Re: Sony Ericsson P800

- Corrupt files, Info exchange between Psion and phone,

- Cycle through apps

*++++++++++&

Date: 23 Aug 2003 18:33:31 +0000

From: Epoc Digest

Subject: Digest business

Hello,

Over Q

For several weeks, we have been unable to send digests to the above accounts resulting in the digests being returned. We have had no choice but to discontinue your subscription because returned digests take up alot of space in the mailbox. Hopefully, you are able to read this from another source and re-subscribe with another address.

Thank you for your kind attention.

Best regards,

Dick Chatjaval

Epoc Digest Team

*++++++++++&

Date: 22 Aug 2003 18:39:45 +0000

From: Kevin Thorne

Subject: 9210 printing

If I try to print from the Messaging app I always get this dialog box (then the app shuts down):

Application: Mail Editor

Reason Code: E32USER-CBase

Reason number: 21

Anybody know what this problem could be?

Also, I'm still not having much luck with printing in general. Suggestions so far: Get a Citizen CN60. The discontinued Citizen CN60 works well for direct IR printing but I can't get hold of one of these (and ideally want to keep my Canon BJ-10 with Psion IR pod). Get PDF Printer and print from that (as ER6 apparently can print graphics files much better). I haven't done this yet as I've tried printing other graphic files (such as images) with no success. There are other ways such as print via a PC (which I don't have) or email the file to myself and then print it out from my Psion ER5 machine (which works wonderfully with the Canon) but really I want to print directly to a printer. Any ideas and (PN60 excepted) can the Communicator actually print directly to ANY other printer?

Sent to you from a Nokia 9210 Communicator

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Date: 22 Aug 2003 19:25:47 +0000

From: Steve Richardson

Subject: CF update

Just Brought a 128Mb CF from Novatech in Portsmouth (handy when its 5 mins down the road) for 23 UKP

..formatted it as per the recommended FAT/Cluster sizes...

Expected the worst.. slow performance over my ageing 48Mb one

Goes like a rocket

Its an unbranded "made by Toshiba"

________________________________

Steve Richardson

Microsoft Consultancy and Services

ITS Services Business,

IBM Global Services

*++++++++++&

Date: 23 Aug 2003 00:03:46 +0000

From: Trygve Henriksen

Subject: RTF files...

Greetings!

Martin wrote

> By the way: the Symbian Word format *is* the RTF format

> with a wrapper. Basically, the Neuon nConvert for ER5

> makes use of this fact, making the 'conversion' between

> RTF and Symbian Word format extremely fast, they're just

> removing the wrapper.

I don't think so....

-----

\jcompress\viewkind4\viewscale120\nolnhtadjtbl \fet0\sectd \linex0\sectdefaultcl {\footer \pard\plain \qc \li0\ri0\widctlpar\faauto\rin0\lin0\itap0 \f215\fs24\lang1033\langfe1033\cgrid\langnp1033\langfenp1033 {\f6\fs20 \chpgn

\par }}{\*\pnseclvl1\pnucrm\pnstart1\pnindent720\pnhang{\pntxta .}}{\*\pnseclvl2\pnucltr\pnstart1\pnindent720\pnhang{\pntxta .}}{\*\pnseclvl3\pndec\pnstart1\pnindent720\pnhang{\pntxta

------

See that piece of gobbledygook?

That was cut from near the start of a .rtf file...

A .RTF file is just text format(7bits in fact, so must even code the upper part of the alpabet), and every command is bracketed the way you see here.

There's none of this in a Word file.

.RTF files also tend to be bigger than Word files....

Maybe Word on Symbian 6.0/7.0 uses .RTF as internal format, but Word on ER3/ER5 doesn't.

Also, all the documentation I've seen claims that all EPOC file formats are 'streams', not 'ordinary files' so don't expect anything beyond the first few Bytes to stay in a fixed position...

(All Computer litterature is vague on the concept of 'streams', but it features most often in C++ manuals)

:-)

Trygve

*++++++++++&

Date: 23 Aug 2003 01:51:14 +0000

From: martin

Subject: Subject: Symbian Word format and RTF conversion macro

Subject: Symbian Word format and RTF conversion macro U Hornstein wrote:

>>>1) called within the symbian Word program:

>saves the current file as a symbian word file under filename.rtf (yes, ..rtf); >opens filename.rtf in an editor and removes the wrappers; saving the result under the same filename.rtf - now it would really contain a rtf file. >

>2) does the reverse of 1): called from system; user sets the cursor on a M$ filename.rtf file ; macro opens the rtf file in an editor;

>adds the wrapper(s); saves the result as a Symbian Word file filename (without .rtf).<<<

nConvert for ER5 from Neuon(www.neuon.com)already does No 2. So why would you need a Macro?

On No 1. I would rather suggest that you save the file as Symbian Word (a.k.a. EPOC Word), and then use nConvert to

convert it to an RTF file.

nConvert supports the RTF v1.5 specification which is still - as far as I know - the latest. You can check it

out with a very comprehensive description on http://www.cena.dgac.fr/~sagnier/info/formats/rtf/rtfspe15.htm

cheers

Martin

*++++++++++&

Date: 23 Aug 2003 02:11:37 +0000

From: Digital Progress

Subject: Subject: netBook pro

Subject: netBook pro

Answer to Itamar

>>>Answer to: Gianluca Gallino RE. netBook pro - You wrote "The more names on the list the higher likelihood that we will see a Symbian OS version of the new netBook Pro as well". I have kept out of this discussion mainly, but I don't think you can prove this statement to be true. You can't prove that they will listen at all, even if you had 1 million signatures. I admire your perseverence, but don't make statements you cannot prove to be correct. <<<

Itamar, so you are meaning to say that he needs to *prove* that the petition will succeed before he even asks people to sign??!!

You are being very unreasonable.

cheers

Martin

*++++++++++&

Date: 23 Aug 2003 03:13:53 +0000

From: koihin

Subject: Re: Psion Replacement

Reply to: Jim Watson-Gove

Hi Jim,

LW>I can't beat the Dana. It is better than the 5mx for heavy duty WP.

I have no doubt the Dana is better than the 5MX for word-processing, after all, the Dana has a almost full-sized keyboard. (altough I have not tried the Dana before) The Dana is also significantly larger and heavier than the 5MX. A closer match in terms of form-factor and weight would be the Psion netBook. I would be interested in hearing how the 2 keyboards compare.

JW>I tried the Zaurus out in the store (the one with a thumb-board) and found the thumb-board wanting - the Treo thumb board is much better and is what sold me enough to try it ou...

I was referring to the Zaurus C7xx series which uses a membrane type keyboard, I can't get hold of it in retail stores because it is only offically sold in Japan.

warm regards,

Koi Hin

*++++++++++&

Date: 23 Aug 2003 12:08:19 +0000

From: Sergio Strati

Subject: Re: opera save pdf problem

BTW, is there any other turnaround to solve this problem or it is just something we have to deal with?

If you delete c:\system\pdfplus\pdfplus.ini you'll resolve all problems!

Here is a opl program! Start it before opera!

PROC main:

WHILE key=0

IF EXIST("c:\system\apps\pdfplus\pdfplus.ini")

DELETE "c:\system\apps\pdfplus\pdfplus.ini"

ENDIF

IF EXIST("c:\system\apps\pdf\pdf.ini")

DELETE "c:\system\apps\pdf\pdf.ini"

ENDIF

ENDWH

STOP

END

*++++++++++&

Date: 23 Aug 2003 21:01:15 +0000

From: Kevin Thorne

Subject: Long lasting S7/netBook

Reply to Martin:

To me, it seems as though upgrade fever is getting to some of us, judging by all the discussion on the NetBook Pro! I always look around at other machines to rival my S7 yet always end up returning to the cosy familiarity of my ER5 machine. I'd just like to add that I often go away for weekends and when I first got my S7 (in 2000) I used to always carry the mains unit to make sure I'd have enough power to last. I soon realised this was a pointless exercise in carrying unnecessary extra weight as I always seemed to return home without having to access a mains socket when I was away. This advantage alone makes the S7/netBook a little marvel in my book.

Regards

Kevin Thorne

*++++++++++&

Date: 23 Aug 2003 22:36:49 +0000

From: Rolf Brunsting

Subject: Re: Can't Resist An OT

Dear Keith,

<< Another one of those yuppie coffee shops that are screwing up a good old American tradition - the bottomless cup >>

My pre-Starbucks experience of US coffee is that it's served in very large cups the size of tankard and so weak that you can see the bottom of the tankard when full. Don't know what happened during coffee's travels from the Middle East via Europe to the US but US coffee literally pales in comparison to the real thing. It's thanks to Starbucks that I've beem able to get good coffee, prepared in the Italian style, in the US. It's served at the right strength, meaning that the coffee is dark enough for the bottom of the cup to disappear from view. Starbucks therefore serves a true 'bottomless cup'.

<< Oh, by the way, you must have low- or no-fat latte available >>

A true Latte is made with fat milk because it's the job of the milk to take the edge of the taste and that of the fat to polish it into a smooth taste. Low-fat Latte is one of these horrible Americanisms like deep pan pizza.

By the way, I was in Denver, Colorado a few years ago for the annual convention and exhibition of the Petroleum Equipment Institute. The convention centre, fortunately, had two small counters at which Espresso coffee was served. First thing we did when arriving at the convention centre around 09:00am was to get a double Espresso because the hotel only served American non-coffee. I normally went back to the counter for a second double Espresso at around 10:30am. But when I went back for a third on the first day of the convention, at around 12:00am, the young lady behind the counter refused to serve me one. When asked why, she said that I'd had two already and that a third would damage my health. It was fortunate that I had a US colleague with me who had lived in the Netherlands for seven years. After he'd stopped laughing, he explained to the young lady that I was from the Netherlands where people drink large volumes of coffee. She therefore wouldn't get into trouble by serving me a third double Espresso, nor by a fourth, fifth or sixth during the afternoon. She would actually get into trouble by _not_ serving me one because going without coffee for more that two hours would certainly damage my temper as well as my health.

Kind Regards,

Rolf Brunsting - Darp - Netherlands

*++++++++++&

Date: 23 Aug 2003 22:36:59 +0000

From: Rolf Brunsting

Subject: Re: EPOC DIGEST V1 # 323 (3)

Dear Itamar,

Psion replacement?

<< I have thought for some time about adding a palmtop to my S7 to walk around with when not carrying my S7 (evening social appointments, week-ends, etc.). The palmtop would become basically a diary and phonebook machine and could be quite downgraded from the Psions >>

You didn't gave me much chance to respond to your request for input for a new mobile phone. I was half way writing a message, only to read that you'd already bought a SonyEricsson T610. The phone I wanted to suggest to you is also a SonyEricsson but then the P800. Reason is that you'd previously indicated that:

a) You were thinking about a adding a PDA to your Series 7,

and,

b) That you had some difficulty in finding practical applications for using a smartphone.

Well, here's a quite practical application - storing your diary, contacts, to-dos and notes in a smartphone like the P800 rather than a PDA. Why carry a PDA, at additional cost, when you're already carrying a mobile phone?

<< my 5MX is still too large for that and the REVO could do it but for the dreaded battery problem >>

My impression from reading on-line forum messages about the "dreaded battery problem" is that it's more about the word "dreaded" than about the words "battery problem". People suffer most from what they fear. And if these message were true my Revo should have been afflicted by the"dreaded battery problem" for two years already.

<< The question is really what pocket size palmtop can easily exchange diary and phonebook details with my S7 ? >>

Almost all of them can because they support the exchange of v.Card and v.Calendar objects via infrared. You can beam an appointment from a Series 7 to a P800 (and vice versa) just as you can to (say) a Palm Tungsten T. Question is whether you're going to do this quite frequently as it's logical to keep your business appointments and to-dos on the Series 7 and your private appointments and to-dos on the PDA or P800. And do you really need to have all contacts as stored in the Series 7 on the PDA or P800 as well?

<< And which machine has a diary comparible (could be third party) to the Psion one ? >>

Simple when it comes to smartphones : the Nokia 9210i, 7650 and 3650 plus the SonyEricsson P800 because they share the same 'diary engine' with the Psions. You don't need to learn new things when you'd use a P800 as your PDA.

Kind Regards,

Rolf Brunsting - Darp - Netherlands

*++++++++++&

Date: 23 Aug 2003 22:37:10 +0000

From: Rolf Brunsting

Subject: Re: Word

Dear Martin,

<< In fact, the ability to save a Symbain Word file as RTF has not been taken out of the Symbian Word engine. But sadly, it is not supported in the Eikon UI, nor is it supported in the Series 80 UI (the UI of the Nokia 9200 series communicators) >>

I learned a loooong time ago that a User Interface (UI) is the range of *common* elements the user interacts with in order to operate and control applications. One of the common elements of the EIKON UI is, for example, that applications have a menu bar that's normally hidden from view unless called up on screen. Also that the first (from left to right) function group on the menu bar is the File group and the last function group the Tool group. And that the File group contains the Close function and the Tool group the About function. The rest of the function groups, and their individual functions, aren't part of the UI but belong to the application. Meaning that the 'Export to text file' function belongs to Word as implemented on the Psions rather than EIKON. The same applies to an 'Export to RTF' function - it's not part of EIKON nor of Series 80 - it's a functions the developer is free to implement. The only thing the developer has to do when (s)he implements it is that the function has to be part of the File function group on the menu bar.

Kind Regards,

Rolf Brunsting - Darp - Netherlands

*++++++++++&

Date: 23 Aug 2003 22:37:18 +0000

From: Rolf Brunsting

Subject: Re: Netbook Pro, Revo Battery Solution,

Dear Itamar,

Netbook Pro

<< First of all the netBook Pro will not be a replacement of our machines at all, lacking apparently all the usual software, and will be geared for a totally different market >>

Psion Teklogix has to supply a number of different configurations in order to meet the requirements of its customers. I therefore think that it will be possible to get a ce.NET based netBook Pro with Pocket Word, Pocket Excel and Pocket Outlook when that's what you want to have. It won't be an inexpensive device, however. The current netBook already costs about £825.= which makes it difficult to justify a purchase when you can get a quite decent Windows XP laptop for that price.

<< Secondly I think EPOC / Symbian have been out of the development of this platform for too long to catch up again, and could only enter again by designing a totally new machine / concept, which would need major investment as well as an appeal to the mass-market instead of "just" enthousiasts like us >>

Note that Symbian OS was developed with the idea that it can be used on more than one platform. Think of the four reference designs Symbian has worked on. The most simple one was for a more advanced alphanumeric pager and the most complex one was for handheld computers. As Martin said, the current version 7 of Symbian OS has all the software building blocks to create a handheld computer in the style of the Revo, Series 5mx or Series 7.

We're now in the situation that the Series 5mx spot in the market has become vacant with the demise of the HP Jornada 720. An updated Series 5mx running Symbian OS 7 with a complete set of applications could fill that spot. Question is whether this market segment is large enough to make the development of such a new Series 5mx a viable proposition long term. A company like Sony is large enough to see a market gap, develop the UX-50 to fill it and to see how well it does. It will be a one-of when it doesn't, with Sony taking some of the elements UX-50 users liked over to other devices. The money it loses on the UX-50 will be compensated by products that sell very well, like the Playstation 2 games machine. And when the UX-50 meets Sony's minimum sales performance standards we can be quite sure that a successor will be on the market in 1 to 1.5 years time. Psion isn't in the same position and has to sail a safer route in order not to jeopardise the whole company.

Revo Battery Solution

<< Right and wrong. When my T610 or S7 battery is 75% full I can recharge both back to 100% capacity, with the REVO you can charge only once down to 15% otherwise you can get problems. With the S7 I have a spare battery which will give me 10 to 12 hours of constant usage, even more than needed for that very long flight, while the telephone will easily hold out for 2 days (I don't use it that heavily). Furthermore both are rechargeable in a car as well. >>

Wrong on all counts, I'm afraid.

1) There's nothing to prevent you from recharging the Revo's batteries at any point in time. When you're going to take a long haul flight tomorrow you simply put the Revo on its cradle tonight and have a fully charged set of batteries tomorrow.

2) General rule for rechargeable batteries is that it's beneficial to run them down down to almost empty occasionally. Say - once every two months. When you have an 'in the office' week without business trips nor business meetings in the neighbourhood of London you can safely afford to run the Revo's batteries down and recharge them in the office or at home. The same applies to your Series 7 and T610.

3) A 75% Revo charge level will last you for the 7-hour flight you mentioned in your previous message. The battery of the Series 7 won't last that long, meaning you need to carry a (preferably fully charged) spare battery. And when you use a Revo with the same intensity as your T610 it will also last for at least 2 days.

4) The Revo's batteries can also be recharged in your car just as you can recharge the batteries of your Series 7 and T610.

Kind Regards,

Rolf Brunsting - Darp - Netherlands

*++++++++++&

Date: 23 Aug 2003 22:37:34 +0000

From: Rolf Brunsting

Subject: Re: Sony Ericsson P800

Dear Robin,

<< Since Sony-Ericsson uses the Symbian open source OS, like Psion, it does mean that people are writing applications all the time for the P800 >>

Just a small correction - Symbian OS isn't open source, like Linux, but owned by Symbian Ltd. which has Psion, Nokia, SonyEricsson, Matsushita, Motorola and Siemens as shareholders. When you want to use Symbian OS in a device you'll have to license it from Symbian Ltd. and pay the corresponding license fees. The software developments kits for Symbian OS are also owned by Symbian Ltd. but are distributed on-line free of charge.

Kind Regards,

Rolf Brunsting - Darp - Netherlands

*++++++++++&

Date: 24 Aug 2003 01:29:05 +0000

From: Itamar Engelsman

Subject: Corrupt files, Info exchange between Psion and phone,

Answer to: Jim

Re.: Corrupt files - I still believe the best way to use a CF card is to store all the programs and use the C (internal) disk for your files. I actually never had a corrupt file this way.

Answer to: Rolf

Re.: Info exchange between Psion and phone - Your answer was quite clear. Could someone please send instructions to the digest what you need to exchange info between a Psion and a phone like the T610 and how to do it both ways ? Maybe the phone could play the companion task with the Psion ?

Best regards,

Itamar Engelsman

London, UK

*++++++++++&

Date: 24 Aug 2003 10:00:27 +0000

From: U Hornstein

Subject: Cycle through apps

Hi Group,

recently we had a good discussion about using silk keys for data with "all comfort", meaning putting data into forground and cycling through all open data files. Thanks, Wolfgang Golder.

This made me wonder if someone could solve one of my last minor inconveniencies on my MC218:

When running StickyKeys, a very good app when lying in bed and having to type with one hand only, the cycling through all open apps via Macro5 is not working any more.

For those who are not using this: it works like Alt-Tab in Windoze; I did put it on Ct+Menu to allow for one-hand operation.

The author of StickyKeys knows about it and cannot solve it (or does not have the time).

Is there a task cycling program around that I am not aware of - it must work together with StickyKeys, of course. Unfortunately, the otherwise useful tool TaskBar does not support task cycling.

If not, could someone of the EPOC system professionals on this list write something (macro, App), which would:

-) cycle through all open apps like Macro5 does it (Menu Tools Kotkeys System TaskCycling)

-) it should work also with StickyKeys running.

[ -) if possible, one should be able to call it via Ct+Menu (should work with a Macro5 Hotkey)]

I tried a simple Macro with just a BgCurrent: in it; this is not sufficient as this cycles around all apps in one big loop only. What I want is the Alt-Tab Function of Windoze.

The Author of StickyKeys, Marc Boogaards, offers access to his source code as well (in his readme.txt). He says:

[To compile StickyKeys the EPOC R5 SDK is needed. To modify the program, a good working knowldge of EPOC is essential. Unfortunately documentation is minimal...]