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Epoc Digest Sun, 07 Dec 2003 Volume 01 : Number 395
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Sent to: 790 subscribers
In today's Epoc Digest 20 messages:
==============================
- RE: Epoc Digest V1 # 393 (4)
- A move away from Psion
- Progress
- PPC and Palms
- Netbook faxes through R520m but 5mx will not, any ideas?
- Re: Epoc Digest V1 # 394 (9) - Darryl and Scott
- Agenda Views
- Pocket PC calender view
- Progress
- Re: Et tu, Brute
- Differences between the Malaybook and the Netbook
- Palm OS5 vs. OS6
- subscribe
- Re: zExe # 392
- Dell Axim X3i,
- nB Pro OS 7, Brutus, Dell Axim X3i, Psions for sale, Keyboard not working,
- Sony Clie PEG-NR70,
- Re: zExe
- Re: benefit of a feature,wiss_kid: re Antony,Itamar,Rolf
- Re: Progress
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Date: 5 Dec 2003 09:36:51 +0100
From: Roy Maidment
Subject: RE: Epoc Digest V1 # 393 (4)
Hello All,
Antony (Steele?), regarding PPC wrote
<< There is no screen zoom-in / zoom-out feature with any applications,
another disappointing issue for me >>
I tried an HP 2210 at an airport recently, and could change the % view in
Pocket Excel. Didn't try pocket word though. What seems to be more amusing
is, I read that the Tungsten T3 - using Documents to Go 6 - handles
conversion to and from Native Word and Excel, better than Pocket PC!
Must admit, that looking for a Psion successor feels like stepping into a
whirlwind. Nothing seems clear from either Pocket PC or Palm camps. Some
things that I have learned very quickly however:
Some PPCs support both SD/MMC and CF cards. Palm (excluding Sony machines)
only support the former
PPC tend to be much more expensive, when compared to the equivalent Palm
machine
Getting information about PPC software is very difficult, involving a trawl
through the MS website (never a joy)
You can download and read the Tungsten T3 manual, or videos showing set-up
etc from their websites - a big plus in my mind
Lastly, it pays to have an American friend! Tungsten T3 can be bought in
the UK for around GBP 285.00. In America, the same machine retails for US$
399.00 - about GBP 231.00. Luckily, I know a fine American chap, who will
bring me one back from the US in January!
Apologies to all non platform-shifting approvers, for the long post!
With best regards,
RoyM
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Date: 6 Dec 2003 10:28:50 +0100
From: Austin Mitchell
Subject: A move away from Psion
I've recently moved away from Psion as my main provider of PDAs. I had an MC218, netBook and Revo which I have replaced with a Palm Tungsten T3. I decided to do this as I have a PC for real data entry and needed something to carry around for mainly viewing purposes. The T3 is an excellent replacement!
Don't listen to the 'it's not multitasking' argument - in most situations it really doesn't matter as apps open quickly. Also, with the wireless keyboard the T3 can be used in landscape mode for serious data entry with *on board* Word editing. (May not be to everyone's taste but Word is the standard...) The T3 also supports bluetooth which allows me to connect to my PC anywhere in the house.
The real killer peripheral for the T3 would be a case which doubles as a keyboard. Since the T3 can be used in landscape, a decent keyboard could be built into the top of the case...
Austin.
My journey: Siena, 3c, 3mx, 5mx, Handspring, 5mx, Palm IIIc, MC218, netBook, Palm Tungsten, netBook, MC218, Revo, Palm Tungsten T3
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Date: 6 Dec 2003 10:53:44 +0100
From: Timothy H.D. Williams
Subject: Progress
On Saturday, December 6, 2003, at 05:47 am, DKempster wrote:
> I was never interested in a PC cos they always appeared shit.
Tut, tut. You really should mind what you say!
Correction: PC cos they always APPEAR (and will appear) shit.
Best
T (for the Macintosh community)
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Date: 6 Dec 2003 11:12:10 +0100
From: Roy Maidment
Subject: PPC and Palms
Hello All,
Antony (Steele?), regarding PPC wrote
<< There is no screen zoom-in / zoom-out feature with any applications,
another disappointing issue for me >>
I tried an HP 2210 at an airport recently, and could change the % view in
Pocket Excel. Didn't try pocket word though. What seems to be more amusing
is, I read that the Tungsten T3 - using Documents to Go 6 - handles
conversion to and from Native Word and Excel, better than Pocket PC!
Must admit, that looking for a Psion successor feels like stepping into a
whirlwind. Nothing seems clear from either Pocket PC or Palm camps. Some
things that I have learned very quickly however:
Some PPCs support both SD/MMC and CF cards. Palm (excluding Sony machines)
only support the former
PPC tend to be much more expensive, when compared to the equivalent Palm
machine
Getting information about PPC software is very difficult, involving a trawl
through the MS website (never a joy)
You can download and read the Tungsten T3 manual, or videos showing set-up
etc from their websites - a big plus in my mind
Lastly, it pays to have an American friend! Tungsten T3 can be bought in
the UK for around GBP 285.00. In America, the same machine retails for US$
399.00 - about GBP 231.00. Luckily, I know a fine American chap, who will
bring me one back from the US in January!
Apologies to all non platform-shifting approvers, for the long post!
With best regards,
RoyM
*++++++++++&
Date: 6 Dec 2003 11:26:23 +0100
From: David Froggatt
Subject: Netbook faxes through R520m but 5mx will not, any ideas?
Netbook faxes through R520m but 5mx will not, any ideas?
I can send a fax from my netbook(build 450) via Infrared through my R520 (even though Ericsson told me "it is not possible") but I can't do this through the same modem setup on my 5mx.....
Any suggestions as to updates, even any suggestions as I can't hump the netbook as easily as the 5'...?
With regards,
G'David
Back at home down under
PS Congratulations on a fine game England!
*++++++++++&
Date: 6 Dec 2003 13:03:14 +0100
From: jgthomson
Subject: Re: Epoc Digest V1 # 394 (9) - Darryl and Scott
Reply to Darryl Kempster and Scott Lloyd.
Like a breath of fresh air, your words of wisdom were. I do not believe that you are in the minority Darryl. The problem is - How do we convince a
company like Psion to stick it out and build on their already fabulous developments.
I started work as a programmer back in 1967 after getting fed up with 7 years in the Civil Service. I bought an S3a in 1993 and now have a 5mx and a Netbook. Both are infinitely more powerful than the 4.5 million quids worth I started working on. And I agree, the odd socket to enable another external device to be hung on now and again would help (maybe a USB port). These machines hardly ever give me any bother, while my XP system keeps telling
me that my applications are proving troublesome and are being closed down. That even although I have the XP upgardes downloaded and installed automatically, whenever I am on the Net and my PC system is supposedly
bang up-to-date all the time. I know different and that it is simply that XP doesn't cope.
Long live the EPOC system. Maybe, if Symbian could be persuaded to make
the system open source, we could all pull together to force Windows-X
systems into a poorer slot in the Op Sys tables.
Regards,
Jim Thomson.
160 Main Street, Carnwath, Lanark, ML11 8HR.
e-mail address: jgthomson
Tel: 01 555 840 832 / 07 050 074 336
*++++++++++&
Date: 6 Dec 2003 13:13:41 +0100
From: Andy Hayes
Subject: Agenda Views
Hi all
There is a way to display the To Do list on the left hand page and the day view on the right hand page in Psion's Agenda. I have looked through my netBook manual and can't find the answer. Can someone help me out here?
Thanks
Andy Hayes
*++++++++++&
Date: 6 Dec 2003 14:00:43 +0100
From: "Chaand Nagpaul"
Subject: Pocket PC calender view
Dear Anthony
Re your Dell Axim pocket PC, you wrote:
<< .. and the "week view" shows blocks to represent "busy" periods - but not a clue as to what you are doing. A quick tap on each block shows the event details, but if you think you will get a nice weekly view like on the 5MX - think again! >>
If you download "pocket Informant|" (www.pocketinformant.com), it will provide you with a week to a view option, which although small, is perfectly usable, and maintains the functionality you are used to in the 5mx. Without it, I simply could not get on with a pocket PC-I need to have an assesment of my week, not blocks per day which you have to tap..
Chaand
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Date: 6 Dec 2003 14:06:58 +0100
From: Cyril Catt
Subject: Progress
Hear! Hear! Darryl Kempster. The 3a served my need for a proper computer that could be carried at all times, to locations far from any power supplies, for weeks at a time, on the off chance that it would be needed to actually do some work with - ie word processing, spreadsheeting or databasing . And, of course, it could carry reams of data I might need whilst away from home. And its manuals enabled me (in the absence of any local guru) to work through how to use it; whilst the internal and external software provided for it permitted easy file exchange with Macs and PCs on my return home.
The P5 manual is wellnigh useless, so file transfer to and from it is an arcane rigmarole that I've never mastered (despite much well meaning advice emailed by many other kind owners), and without the ability to backup my work there seems little sense in using it - although hope springs eternal that one day I will overcome the file transfer obstacle and be able to put its well integrated suite of apps to use.
Although the Palm provides for easy file transfer with Macs and PCs, its lack of a keyboard, and small screen, make it unsuitable for my needs - even after I have supplied the wordprocessing, spreadsheet and databasing applications, which it lacks.
Whilst waiting for the unlikely miracle of a keyboarded PDA to suit my needs, I make do with a constant filofax companion and occasionally lugging a small iBook.
Cyril catt
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Date: 6 Dec 2003 14:56:09 +0100
From: Edgar Brazda MD, PhD
Subject: Re: Et tu, Brute
>>"You too, my son?" in Greek.
> Most English speakers are more familiar with Shakespeare's > interpretation of the story:
>>Et tu, Brute?
>>
>>(et TOOH BROOH -tay) A Latin sentence meaning "Even you, Brutus?" >>from the play Julius Caesar , by William Shakespeare . Caesar utters
I like Shakespeare, too, my son, but he is not the most authentic source of Roman history for a "non-English speaker". The original Latin saying goes: "Et tu mi fili, Brute?", as Rolf rightly translated it "You too,
my son?" (but the original is not in Greek, of course...)
Edgar, Budapest
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Date: 6 Dec 2003 16:47:46 +0100
From: Thomas F. VAN DER ZIJDEN
Subject: Differences between the Malaybook and the Netbook
Hello Itamar,
1. The Malaybook cannot load any other OS than its own Malaybook OS.
2. On the password screen it says "My schoolbook, my way to knowledge"
3. There is a small bug in the Malaybook Contacts. If you send a contact it arrives on the other machine missing some data.
4. Apparently some symbols are on a different place on the keyboard (but I did not verify that)
5. Some Malaybooks (not mine !) are missing the netBook badge on their keyboard. You see the two small screws.
AFAIK these are it.
I can live with the Malaybook OS. It has Wifisupport, nFTP, Java and Opera in ROM and as far as I can see it is the newest version of ER5 anyway.
Yours truly,
Thomas VAN DER ZIJDEN
*++++++++++&
Date: 6 Dec 2003 17:10:32 +0100
From: Peter Rand
Subject: Palm OS5 vs. OS6
AFAIK, Palmsource will be wrapping up its work on OS6, the new operation system, towards the end of December. New machines (from PalmOne, Sony etc.) based on OS6 will probably start hitting the market 3 to 6 months after that.
Since O6 supposedly adds multi-tasking, greater stability and better native Office document compatibility to the Palm platform, prices of current Palm models will probably drop like a rock after Christmas, prior to the introduction of the new models.
So if you're contemplating a Palm, now is probably a good time to wait and see how the new models perform before making a decision.
I have have not heard a word about the "upgraded" Psion from POS - has anybody else?
Peter
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Date: 6 Dec 2003 18:19:40 +0100
From: Donald
Subject: Netbook and GPRS
can the GPRS T-Mobile air card work reliablably in the US - I have no problems at all with the infra port to the I888 GSM world phone - but we want to upgrade - any advice would be welcome.
Donald
*++++++++++&
Date: 6 Dec 2003 23:24:54 +0100
From: Alan Morris
Subject: Re: zExe # 392
vlad a
>> The cleaver bit is getting a very fast algorithm to
>> uncompress.
>
> Got it. Thanks!
>
> I suppose you can do such a trick only on a Psion, otherwise
> they'd have done it on Macs too :-)
To continue my comments Vlad, it can be done on any computer. On a Psion (Revo) it saves memory, but years ago I used PKzip to compress files onto a floppy. A DOS batch file would unzip to the hard disk and run the program and when the program ended the files produced on the hard disk (only a few Mb in those days) were deleted.
Today I still use PKzip and batch files for all my Windows backup. The only extra from DOS is to have icons for the batch files on the desktop.
The method could also be used on an Apple.
--
Alan R Morris, G4ENS.
Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, UK.
Using a Psion netBook & Nokia 6210e.
*++++++++++&
Date: 7 Dec 2003 01:25:55 +0100
From: Itamar Engelsman
Subject: Dell Axim X3i,
Answer to: Antony Steele
Re.: Dell Axim X3i - Thanks for your report two digests ago. In comparison with the Palm the input of data with a stylus is made easier on the Palm due to the very good handwriting recognition program, although also there the lack of the keyboard is painful. If the screen on the colour REVO will be (nearly) as good as the new Palms/PocketPC it could be a winner for us Psion users. I think the third party diary programs on the Palm are very good, and get near to the Psion program, which for me is still number 1. I still use my S7 diary for all my client follow-up which I could not do on the Palm. As to DATA, again the third party programs on the Palm format are very good and will allow data input via a PC. However, as we all continue to remark, it is still amazing that 8 years after brought out the EPOC programs are still the best available for us.
Best regards,
Itamar Engelsman
London, UK
*++++++++++&
Date: 7 Dec 2003 01:26:00 +0100
From: Itamar Engelsman
Subject: nB Pro OS 7, Brutus, Dell Axim X3i, Psions for sale, Keyboard not working,
Answer to: Rolf Brunsting
Re. nB Pro OS 7 - Sure I used an exceptional example but it is a 15 years old program after all. Surely the last few versions of Windows do allow for backwards compatibillity ? With the Psion OS that has hardly been the case between different machines (as opposed to new versions of the same machine). But even between versions of the same machine it has been difficult and impossible without third party help (contacts program for example not compatible with DATA).
Re. Brutus - I am quite sure I learned as well that he was Ceasar's son, but I don't have the resources to prove it.
Re. Dell Axim X3i - This week I had a meeting in Franc and decided not to tak my S7 into the meeting and to write my notes instead. The guy I met with than asked me if I minded he took notes on his laptop, which consistently pinged with new emails as he had a wireless connection <G>. It is getting more and more accepted to use computers instead of handwritten notes. However, I don't think thumbboards will ever replace a keyboard for taking longer notes, nor will handwriting recognition do. It just works too slow IMHO.
Answer to: Antony Steele
Re. Psions for sale - While I also migrated partially to a Palm, I don't agree with your conclusions. The Psion is not an "emergency" email tool, it is still my MAIN email tool. When traveling I receive ALL my emails from work as well as ALL the faxes that come in via my outlook mailbox too. I read and answer it all on my S7 as well. Secondly, if your opinion of the 5MX is that high, why not buy a new one (5MX PRO) that is still available for a good price ? I bought the Palm basically to have a pocketable PDA and to have one to show off my photography work. In the office I sitll use my S7 for my work diary and my follow up of contacts, as well as for a variety of DATA that I want to have with me at all times. If you want colour, go for the Malaybook or the netBook.
Answer to: Hoffman, Susan
Re. Keyboard not working - Take out the batteries as well as the back-up battery and wait 15 minutes or so. Put them in again and you have performed a hard resets. Do hope you have a back-up available. I am not sure it is the screen cable as usually it shows up with problems on the screen and not the keyboard.
Best regards,
Itamar Engelsman
London, UK
*++++++++++&
Date: 7 Dec 2003 01:26:02 +0100
From: Itamar Engelsman
Subject: Sony Clie PEG-NR70,
Answer to: Aleck Cartwright
Re.: Sony Clie PEG-NR70 - I think it was replaced by the NX73V and I own one of those. It is a nice machine that does some things well and others better than the Psion, but I would not say it replaces my S7.
Music sounds much better and it comes with an earphone, the screen is better and you can use it to show photos and take pictures. However, the screen is smaller and you can't really use it in landscape format. Another advantage is that it fits neatly into your jacket. The thumbboard is nice for small notes or data input, but I don't even try to write emails or word files on it. The numbers are difficult to get to as well as many signs are unclear. I find however that the handwriting recognitiion program works quite well. For me it complements my S7 but certainly does not replace it. I don't do any synchronisation between the two. If you have more specific questions, just ask away.
Best regards,
Itamar Engelsman
London, UK
*++++++++++&
Date: 7 Dec 2003 05:02:06 +0100
From: Jaan Sass
Subject: Re: zExe
Hi
Had a chance to play with zExe and overall found it to be a good program. I disagree with the premise below and am able to launch all my programs. I use it primarely for Opera. I tried it with some system programs but had difficulty with it and had to do a hard reset. I find it primarily useful with bigger programs such as opera.
Sincerely
Jaan Sass
BrJaanFrancis BSCDAIM: bjaanfrancis32
> I have followed the interesting discussion regarding
> zExe. However, I can imagine that if the zExe program
> should for some reason become corrupt, I would not then
> be able to open ANY application on the Psion, other than
> those loaded in ROM. If those applications were
> essential to me, I would be reluctant to use zExe.
> Ciao
> Daniele Squarci
> Italy
Bye bye
*++++++++++&
Date: 7 Dec 2003 05:02:10 +0100
From: Jaan Sass
Subject: Re: benefit of a feature,wiss_kid: re Antony,Itamar,Rolf
I agree and am not 49 but 36. I have looked at Palms, Pocket PC's, and some of the more exciting Linux products and have not seen a machine that could replace my Psion 7. Part of the problem of course for me is the cost. The other big issue is none I have looked at can do in terms of data entry, start up, ease of use, and have the functionality and simplicity of the epoc os I have grown to love. My first PDA device was a sharp wizard which was a dos based machine. Afterward I purchased a Diamond Mako which I loved to death. I then purchased a Psion 7 color, use of flash cards, easy mail program and a great community to boot. The only other machine that I have seen that comes close cannot use the mobipocket reader and is a Linux based machine. Any machine I own has to be able to use an old fashion wired ISP I cannot afford wireless, the functionality including keyboard of the Psion 7/netbook. Be able to use the software I have come to love. A color screen is a plus and the ability to be used without a PC. The only machine I would seriously consider is the Sharp Zaurus's and the only one I could afford is the 5500 or 5600 but unfortunately can not use mobipocket on it. Laptops that are small enough to replace the 7/netbook cost way to much and are not as sturdy this is the other requirement. I am hard on everything I own and the 7 is very sturdy and resilient. Again I use my Psion 7 for everything at home including net surfing. At work for most of my paper work in sync with the PC at work.
Sincerely
Jaan Sass
BrJaanFrancis BSCDAIM: bjaanfrancis32
*++++++++++&
Date: 7 Dec 2003 09:41:08 +0100
From: Owen H. Morgan
Subject: Re: Progress
Howdy!
I believe the single most important reason Psion started loosing market shares and eventually stopped making PDAs was not that the consumers didn't want palmtops with keyboards, but that they simply had no idea what a Psion is capable of.
When first shown my Psions and particularly the Revo, people think it's just an organiser with an addressbook and simple agenda like a slightly better version of those little keyboard machines you would get for free when subscribing to some magazine.
I still frequently get people going Wow! when I tell them I do all my e-mails on this thing, and the Wow gets even bigger when I say I've been doing it for six years and there have been times when I received 20 e-mails (not spam) a day and sent out around half that number.
The reason Psion lost market shares was that people who just needed an organizer would buy a Palm or similar device, as a keyboard isn't really necessary on a simple organizer, and people who needed a real portable computer would think their only option was a laptop and not realize that a Psion could do the job.
If Psion had given the option of a colour model, offered a way of connecting to external storage devices etc. (this would have been easy if the CF slot had worked with the door open) and made a decent effort of marketing their machines, particularly in the USA, they would still have been the market leaders.
There are other reasons of well of course:
* Peeling paint on the S5 Classic.
* The screen cable problem.
* No new models for ages except the Revo which is a nice machine, but less capable than the 5mx and the S7/Netbook which is overkill for most people.
* Real or perceived battery problems on the Revo
* No (small) model with a colour screen.
* Slow and unstable desktop connection via PsiWin
* Totally shitty Mac connection.
* Unreliable synchronisation with desktop software.
The OS and software in the WinCE devices was (and is) a lot less capable than EPOC, but most of them were probably less prone to actually break and this is an important consideration when forking out a lot of hard earned dosh.
Another point is that many people mistook the Psions for WinCE devices and had already decided against WinCE either through personal experience or what they had heard from others. I can't be the only one who has had people comment on my Psion and say that they had decided against buying one because WinCE was so unstable!
Personally I have stuck with my Psions because there really is nothing to beat them, particularly when living on a boat where the power consumption of my laptop is a real issue. In the past six years I have suffered peeling paint on two 5ives, broken screen cables on the same two 5ives and one MC218, learned how to charge my Mako/Revo to keep it happy, lived happily without colour and never bothered with synchronisation. (I don't need the information on the PC when I've always got with me on the Revo and my life isn't complicated enough for me to use Agenda much anyway.)
The only things I use the WindoZe laptop for are storing and editing photographs, creating and storing MP3 files (for my 20gig MP3 player) and chart plotter software for navigation where no PDA has a screen big enough to be really useful.
Owen
Thought for the day:
Get your facts first... then you can distort 'em as much as you please.
- Mark Twain
--
Owen H. Morgan, Yacht "Naomi J.", LD-928°07.85'N 15°25.66'W
Las Palmas, Gran Canaria
http://home.no.net/naomij
Phone and SMS:
In Spain: +34 620520079
In Norway: +47 92053097
*++++++++++&
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